40 and Out

Show open and aging banter

A host opens the show live from the Pathway Studios in Johnston proper, then the hosts riff on an old opening video where one of them looks about ten years old. They joke about aging, beards, glasses, and whether buying non-prescription hipster glasses counts as vanity.

Episode preview: Pope-style advice, deconversion thread, Dear LFTP

• How does a man go from devout pastor of 40 years to walking away from the faith, and how should the church respond?
• How should we interpret God's will and respond to it?

A host lays out the show: Boova will give Pope-style advice on understanding God's will and reacting to it; the hosts will read a month-old Twitter thread from a former pastor named Dave Gas who announced he is no longer a Christian, asking how that happens and what the church's reaction should be; and there will be Dear LFTP advice.

Studio banter: Boova's half-drunk Diet Coke

The hosts joke about drinks at the table. One host offers Dan a pull off Boova's half-drunk Diet Coke; Dan declines; they tease Boova about backwashing into his soda and blame the beard.

The Dave Gas thread: eighth-grade doubt and hyper-fundamentalist roots

A host reads the opening of Dave Gas's thread ('I am not a Christian anymore'), a former evangelical pastor of 20 years. They note the thread's claim of 40 devout years alongside a seed of doubt from eighth grade reading Greek mythology, and question the honesty of that framing. They observe that people who leave Calvinism tend to leave Jesus entirely rather than move to another theology, concluding they were 'on the wrong side of the lottery.'

The thread on marriage: the shape of the thing without the substance

The hosts react to the thread's claim that the author's marriage was a sham despite doing everything he was 'supposed to' — workshops, counseling, Bible reading, date nights, marriage books. A host calls the 95%-shape argument: most of what Christians call community can be found at a local bar on a Friday night; it is the other 5%, like accountability, that changes everything. Dan cites the book 'Sex Begins in the Kitchen' as an example of marriage literature that did not deliver. The conclusion: doing the shape of Christian practices while missing God himself is 'Jesus busy work.'

The thread on scripture: apologetics, canon, and the presence of questions

Reacting to the thread's complaints about trite apologetics, canonization, and inerrancy, a host concedes some apologetic work is poorly done but argues the key line: 'the presence of questions do not indicate the presence of a problem.' The canonization process looks the same from 1,700 years out whether councils were excluding texts as false or suppressing them; faith that God worked through fallible humans to communicate an infallible message is reasonable, and the host says he has seen Scripture 'not return void.'

The thread on unanswered prayer and suffering

The thread cites 40 years with no witnessed supernatural event, people dying of cancer, 47 funerals, and prayers for healing to no avail. A host is sympathetic but calls the question fair: it does not invalidate everything else, and the underlying problem is processing God through human expectations rather than seeing oneself as a small part of God's story. Boova notes every thread entry begins with 'I.'

Dan's theory: the pastor is burned out

Dan (speaker-2, addressed on-air as Dan) offers the theory that the thread's author is simply burned out: a pastor who missed only 12 Sundays in 40 years is not taking Sabbath. His burnout signal is hating people and not being sure he likes God. The hosts agree the clues fit — the missing rest, the mechanized faith, the exhaustion.

The thread on the system: no 'diet Yahweh'

Reading the thread's conclusion that 'the system just doesn't work,' the hosts agree with him on the system but not on Jesus: cultural Christianity fused with western Americanism is a system that will fail because 'Yahweh doesn't offer a light version' — there is 'no diet Yahweh,' He runs at full strength. The New Testament speaks positively of religion; the problem is mechanization. Even in the Bible, the first two people God created rebelled immediately, and still He went ahead — 'he did it anyway.'

The pastor's resume: megachurches and the nursery joke

The thread lists pastoring megachurches and tiny churches, college, camp, youth, music, preaching, and church-planting ministries. The hosts joke he should have worked in the nursery — 'maybe that would have worked then' — and note the megachurch claims may be exaggerated.

The Christian Post follow-up: Justin Thuttle's response

A host reads a Christian Post follow-up: deacon Justin Thuttle of Grace Family Fellowship in Pleasant Hill, Missouri, said the author had an affair with a married woman in the church for almost a year, never repented, and still lives with her; the church confirmed Thuttle's account and added that, to their knowledge, none of the churches where Gas was on staff were megachurches. After resigning he cut off all communication with the church.

Righteous indignation at peddling unbelief

The host reading the thread grows angry at the author's admission that he kept ministering while it 'never clicked': 'if you ain't feeling it, if you don't believe it's true, what kind of hypocrite continues to spit it out their mouth?' He calls it borderline abusive to keep preaching what you don't believe — quit influencing people, sit down, 'go work at the freaking Starbucks' — while allowing that struggling openly and asking for help is a different, honest thing.

Church people use the church for power — and leaders get hurt too

Responding to the thread's claim that church people use the church for power and influence and that leaders are abused by congregants, the hosts concede humans are humans but push back: that comes with leading anything of substance, and a megachurch leader is the figurehead for every complaint — 'if you cannot handle running a large organization, you shouldn't do it.' They also reject the thread's claim that Christians suffer at the same rate as nonbelievers, noting the marriage-failure-rate statistic is not true of genuinely practicing believers.

'Gaslighting yourself' and interpreting God through your expectations

The hosts reject the thread's 'I was gaslighting myself' language as misused internet words, and Boova argues the author's core error is interpreting God through his own expectations and plans rather than interpreting himself as part of God's story: 'if you are the main part of your story rather than a small part of God's story, this is absolutely going to happen.' They also note the Ten Commandments prescribe rest — 'take a break' — which the burnout theory missed.

Love among the godless; fear and shame are not Jesus

The thread says he found love among godless people while the church burdens people with fear, shame, and guilt. Boova responds that for someone who read the Bible 24 times, he missed the big statements: fear, guilt, and shame are the enemy's arrows; Jesus constantly says stop being fearful and trust me. A host adds: 'you cannot read the Bible and not want it to change you. If you're not open for it changing you, it will be a collection of stories.' Love in Hebrew and Greek is action, not emotion.

'I was both a slave and a slave driver': impossible standards and the shape filled in

Reacting to the thread's claim of impossible standards, Boova says the standards are impossible by design — 'stop putting yourself as the covenant leader in this' — and the point is to be part of God's story. The hosts agree a fence that keeps you from jumping off a cliff is not a restriction of freedom, and that the shape of Christian practices is fine as long as it is filled in: 'if you have the love of God... all of these will produce fruit' when you are 'part of the vine.' They land on the building-vs-body distinction: one is people showing up in a building, the other is the bride of Christ living and serving.

Wolf in sheep's clothing: the hosts reject that framing

The hosts reject the thread's anticipated 'wolf in sheep's clothing' framing and their own earlier anger: they think the author most likely had a heart that wanted good but fell into 'the most successful possible deceit of ye olde antagonist' — caught up in the shape of faith and picked off. They warn against self-deceit, naming the 'millennial and Buvanized generation' as too cool for school about marketing but great at believing lies 'because it came from your own factory.'

You didn't lose it — you never had it; an invitation to start honest

A host rejects the thread's pity party: 'you didn't lose it. You didn't have it to begin with. You thought you had it. That was a deceit.' Walking away should have been vindication if the faith was bogus, but the tone sounds like a man still weighed down. Boova adds that the author's 'I'm not faking anymore' is genuinely good — 'God is waiting with gold that's been refined' — and promises, 'I'll be praying for' him, framing the stripped-down moment as the start of a possible real relationship with Christ.

Warning and invitation: be honest about unbelief and struggle

The hosts close the thread discussion with a direct warning and invitation: stop the charade — a charade only fools other humans, since God is not fooled — and be brutally honest about unbelief, confusion, or sin before it is pursued. Struggling with a concept of a holy God is not sinful unbelief; 'Jesus appreciates when you bring that to him.' Boova ties it to his own Bible study that morning: it all starts with a loving relationship with God, and the Holy Spirit interceding and calling out sin when we respond.

Pope-bit intro: the pope comes to Boova's apartment

A host launches the recurring Pope-style advice bit with a tall tale: pub regulars insisted the pope was in town, hauled him to Boova's apartment balcony, and demanded advice. Boova appears waving a chicken leg and half a Diet Coke — 'my flag and my standard.' Boova notes he falls for the fake-real story every time.

Pope-style advice: stop asking for 'your will in my life'

Boova (speaker-0, addressed on-air as 'Buba'/'Pope Boob') gives his Pope-style advice on understanding God's will: God rarely reveals the whole plan — Jesus called the fishermen with just 'follow me,' no apostle job description. After a week of solid prayer, Boova says he has dropped 'in my life' from his prayers: 'I don't need to know my specifics. I just need to know how I fit into his story.' His two points: be faithful in the means, and understand God's plans happen on His time, heard through an active personal relationship with Him.

Response to the advice: clear the chaff, your plans stink

The hosts connect the advice to the earlier thread discussion: you cannot hear God speaking if you insist on having your own conversation — the chaff of your own plans, persistent sin, and self-talk. A host says God will not interrupt a twenty-year conversation you do not want interrupted, citing pornography and work lies as examples. Dan adds that faith always starts small — 'Dave, take this sandwich to your brother' before the giant — and the hosts agree 'your plans stink' and should never be presented as God's plans.

Dear LFTP: the unwanted furniture from dad and stepmom

• Must I send a thank-you for a gift I explicitly asked them not to send, and what should I say when they discover I've given it away?
• How do I prevent unwanted gifts like this from happening again?

A listener writes that her father and his wife sent a huge piece of furniture to her small apartment despite her politely refusing — she is pregnant, the piece cannot be returned, will not fit in her car, and she cannot lift it. The hosts say the parents are 100% at fault and the feeling of sending a big gift mattered more than being helpful; do not send a fake thank-you card, have the honest conversation ('do you want it back?'), and use Craigslist or pay someone $5 to haul it. They also read the 'Secular' answer, which advises sending a sweet note plus photos of the crowded living room.

Advice meta: don't try to prove your opinion

A host gives general life advice off the Dear LFTP question: don't put yourself in the middle of things where you cannot arbitrate — 'don't try to out clever yourself by trying to prove your opinion. Just have one.' The hosts call the Secular answer 'terrible advice' apart from its ending ('you can't control what other people do'), and note it is just pride and self-importance that makes you need to prove it.

Sign-off: the complaint line

The hosts close: feedback goes to (515) 517-0085, 'a live from the Path to Plate line' used as the complaint line — 'you don't have to complain, but we figured that was the most reasonable use of it.' They sign off with the show's phrase: 'be faithful in the means. God will handle the ends.'